I hate the fact that they have to shove that Windows 8 POS in my face. I want to buy an ultra book, but I can't find a good one that doesn't have Windows 8 preinstalled. I would rather buy something with no OS installed that way I would have more freedom, but I will never get that. I hope to get at least a choice between 8 or 7, but as I said right now its 8 or don't buy our laptop. For that reason I will probably buy one of those Linux laptop. That Zareason Ultralap is looking pretty sweet. Sorry Microsoft and laptop manufacturing partners but you lost 1 customer because of your BS. :P
OMG sorry for the wrong poll answer.... but your PS4 video brought me here :( ... I didn't saw this was about windows 8
PC hardware will have always more performance than consoles. Here's a comparison of TFLOPS of some gpu's:
PS4 gpu ____ 1.84TFLOPS
AMD Radeon 6870 ____ 2.016TFLOPS
AMD Radeon 7870 ____ 2.99TFLOPS
AMD Radeon 7970 ____ 3.78TFLOPS
Nvidia Geforce GTX 670 ____ 2.45TFLOPS
Nvidia Geforce GTX 680 ____ 3.09TFLOPS
And now comes the interesting thing, game will now be optimized for x86 hardware, so in theory those optimizations should run faster in PC hardware (x86) and in AMD gpu cores, because its the same architecture but it is faster and you can even overclock.
An Intel 4-core is faster than an AMD 8-core, and I guess that the PS4 CPU will have lower clocks than a desktop CPU (for example an AMD FX 8-core 4.0Ghz), because they need to lower TDP, heat and power consumption.
An advantage that I see in the PS4 is the shared 8GB of DDR5, because it means that the GPU can use more ram than most desktop GPU's have.
Yes Windows 8,namely the Metro interface, is extremly bad for PC because you don't have touchscreen.If they launched only 2 versions,one with Metro for touchscreens(new laptops,smartphones,tablets,phablets so one and so forth) and one with NO metro,just normal stuff it would be perfect.
Not just Microsoft is to blame for the so called decline of the PC,let me mention a couple of factors:
1.The rise of powerfull processors,video cards etc.means you dont have to upgrade that often.(an intel c2 duo is very good even now for normal usage)
2.The economic crysis,that didnt go away and has full repercussions on every field,from tech to your local grocery store.
3.PC means problems and for a lot of fellow men,if there is something that could replace it they go for it.
I personally like to take apart,build a PC(and Clean :) ) so I've chossen my side,the PC-side.
Long Live PC :)
hi Rodney the last post was mine
Hi Rodney, I think there are many reasons the PC appears to be in decline, one being the state of the world economy and another being that the increase and saturation of the PC market, people were jumping on the band wagon and buying PC’s in the 90 and 2000’s due to the increase in speed and versatility and greater knowledge of how to use them and the fact that they had become main stream in schools, when I went to school and left in the mid 80’s there were only two very basic PCs in the whole school they were used by only 3 kids out of 1000 students and they only used them in there break times. Also the availability of modern smart phones and the aggressive pricing and methods of payment and advertising all contribute to a new generation of kids using other forms of hardware to view media.
However I truly believe for someone like myself who invested many thousands of pounds in PC’s over the last 23 years and who’s interest in PC only started with games there are some things that could be done to improve the market share.
One of which would be if technically possible would be to allow PC’s,PS3 or PS4,and XBOX to all run on the same server playing against each other this would give the PC owner the edge of console gamers and hopefully increase sales and popularity of the PC for gaming.
I would like to hear your thoughts on that, maybe it would be impossible to do such a thing.
Well Microsoft is definitely not helping the issue. But I think we have to look at another issue. Its called the market saturation point. This means that pretty much everyone that wanted a PC has one, they are happy with what they have and don't need a new one. This goes for businesses as well. The computer industry looks at PC sales like car sales. They expect everyone to go out and get a new one every generational cycle. For Cars that's every 4 to 5 years. for PC its every year. Most people are not willing to replace there computer every year, so there goes those expected sales. Also the PC industry had big sales a few years back because we had the notorious bad capacitor issue that killed allot of PCs very early in there lives. Also certain brands used very poor PSUs and when they died they took the motherboard with them. So in these cases the only choice was to buy a new computer or a total rebuild of the old one. But now we again in a period of stable PCs that are reliable and just plain work so why should consumers replace a perfectly good PC if it doesn't have an problem.
I work as a computer repair tech and let me tell you, since the release of Windows 8 my business is up. My customers are going out of there way to keep what they have. They don't want a new PC and they most certainly do not want Windows 8. Maybe Microsoft needs to do some research with the computer repair industry and see what we can tell them of the present trends. Windows 8 really isn't a bad OS, it has a bad interface and there are tools to fix this. From simply adding fake start menu, to actually replacing the Windows 8 MUI shell with the superior Windows 7 shell. I have personally done this for a few customers and they are very happy with the results and as long as people are happy with what they have they are not going to go blow money on a PC that they don't need with am operating system they don't want.
Google needs to make an OS, they are a really great company.
I don't know if your joking, but just in case your not, they already did its called Android and Chrome OS.. :D
Google needs to make an OS, they are a really great company.
Are any of you that love Windows 8 actually trying to us it in a work environment? LOL
We don't use it at work, but if we did, I don't think we would find much difference since we don't fool with the Microsoft Market or the 'Apps'.
Just as an aside - you can make Win8 work just like Win7. My only real gripes are:
1 In Win8 Microsoft has done away with the Aero UI window dressings in favor of that butt-fugly "Metro" window treatment with no way on earth to get it back. Their idea of themes now seems to be simply changing the color of that horrible window treatment. I HATE IT!!!!
2. The jarring screen switching between the nice, fluid desktop to a single-tasking "take over the whole freakin' screen" app when you really don't want to lose track of what is going on on your desktop. I mean you are pleasantly minding your own business working in your browser, you click a desktop button and YOINK! you are unceremoniously dragged away from your browser to go do whatever it is you clicked on WITH NO SIMPLE WAY TO GET BACK WITHOUT EXITING THAT APP.
Microsoft has lost the idea of how to multitask. Hell even my smart phone will let me juggle a couple of things at the same time on its teensy 5" screen (Android 4.1.2 & Later MultiView).
I absolutely HATE Windows 8! Others seem to like it though, but from what I can tell, those individuals are a minority. The vast majority of Windows users want their familiar Aero theme back and don't like their attention being ripped away from their desktop.
Yes, everyday. It's great. Complete integration between my phone, tablet and work / home desktops. Not sure what people are having a problem with honestly, it all makes a ton of sense.
I don't "love" it so much as I see the possibility for an easy fix to make it a great operating system. It's lean and fast and imo, the raw performance is fantastic. The real problem that almost everyone has issue with is the Metro UI.
It was an extremely hair-brained idea to create a touchscreen UI to run on machines that don't have touchscreens. However, imo Pokki made the experience decent. But I could easily see where someone would be mumbling obscenities at their screen if they didn't even have Pokki installed.
I understand MS wanted access to the mobile device market but this obviously wasn't the way to do it.
All computers will have touchscreen interfaces moving forward.
When people say they don't like Windows8, it's that they don't like it on their old hardware. Fair enough point. Load a 5 year old OS on your 5 year old machine then!
The future isn't the same as the present, is it? It's incredibly stupid to make a product, especially an OS, that's this unfriendly toward today's hardware in favor of something that isn't really mainstream yet. There were was they could have implemented touchscreen tech for the future without making it this unfriendly to the tech of today--Apple did it.
As for my hardware, I'm very pleased with it. I'm even pleased with the raw performance of Win 8. I just hate the Metro UI...and most people that use it do.
Dont be such a hater, Rodney. I use it at work, there is nothing wrong with it.
You still havent responded to our comments.
I don't think Windows 8 is all that bad I use it on my pc with a touch screen and its very nice. It is faster than Windows 7 in every aspect, and it has a "Desktop Mode" all you have to do is click it. Are you that retarded that you cant download a start menu app? There are like 40 (No I am not exaggerating on the number). It is also more stable than Windows 7 and has my heart. Sure its different UI takes a bit to get used to, and it is still very early in development, however, I don't think its killing the PC. Apple is killing the PC but not MS.
I don't think the end of the PC will be anytime soon, even in spite of MS's mess, because there's still too much the PC can do that tablets and other technologies can't do yet. I believe MS will change their tune about Metro at some point--they did the same thing after Vista flopped and went on a "we listened to you and here's what we did" campaign when 7 came out because 8 isn't selling well. Sure, they seem committed...but money is a good motivator.
As far as the sales decline go, I believe it has something to do with computers these days don't seem to become outdated at the pace they used to. It seems like really substantial changes in the CPU market happen at a slower rate now and the pace of the increase in system requirements for new software is also much slower. If you combine that with the terrible economy, for some it doesn't make sense to spend money on something that performs marginally better than what they already have.
In fact, my own story is the desktop I still use today was built in mid 2007, using Intel's Kentfield (their first 4-core). Unless it breaks, I could easily see getting several more years of use out of it, especially if I get a new video card, because the level of performance is about the same as a brand new i7 laptop I got last month.
Sorry for long post. Very interesting topic.
Windows 8 is perfectly fine, sit down with it for more than a few hours before proclaiming it to be aweful. Win8 has nothing to do with the decline, its tablets and smart phones, not the OS.
I'm currently using Win 8 Pro and loving it. I don't have anything fancy like a touchscreen or tablet to work off of, but I still find it faster than any other previous operating systems. I don't think Windows 8 is the problem, but the lack of support from Windows users are. Many many people are afraid to use/buy Windows 8 (even when buying a new PC) because of how different it is.. which is probably the main cause.
Wait until Windows 8 mobile devices start to kick in and SP1 for Win8 rolls around. Its a great operating system.
I ran Windows 8 on my PC and laptop concurrently for a month before uninstalling and reverting to Windows 7.
It was a miserable experience and I am happy again. I could not see any identifiable improvements in either speed or functionality. The old expression if it isn't broken don't fix it would seem to ring true. Windows 8 is about Microsoft trying to muscle in on a closed system like OS X and the app store, it is not about giving PC users a better operating system. Its about greed and control and you fools who use Windows 8 have fallen for it.
This opinion saddens me.
I have been a long time watcher of your site rodney, and i have valued your opinions greatly on parts when i head to my local microcenter or newegg.com. Today though it seems like you finally found my dividing point.
before i head into this, ill give some quick background. i'm a heavy OC gamer, custom rig builder, and have extensive knowledge of hardware. i have played with almost every OS under the sun, and have my master rig listed below with OS choice.
i have built many systems and worked with almost every OS on the market. and like quite a few posts above mine i have to agree that your opinion seems inexperienced. i have not seen the supposed complications you speak of, and what problems i have run into were minuscule compared to the extensive headaches i receive from mac and vista. you claim to hate the OS, but you have yet to tell us what you have done with it or how long you experienced it. out of all of Microsoft OS', 8 has given the users the speed and simplicity that was demanded of before the release of 7. and as with every OS release, 8 is designed to work with the newest technology on the market, which is something that evolves fast these days.
the problem with the market is the market itself. product value and reliability is the cause of the markets decline, not everyone can afford a $200 video card for a game like Crysis 2 (and i believe that not even the best card for that game) when the same exact person can buy a $50 - $79 card with the same exact features from a more reliable manufacturer. the head of Samsung should not be complaining either as some of their own PC products are unreliable as well (my Samsung blu ray drive is less then 6 months old and just died on me with "cannot read drive" errors). companies, like Samsung, are production businesses, which have shown a steady increase in manufacturing. steady might not bee the word for it though. Over-production seems more appropriate in this case. these companies seem to be flooding the market with parts that end up outdated before their time, sitting on shelves and gathering dust before thrown up for sale and maybe bought cause a rig builder notices the sale. there is also the favoritism factor. in the last year we have seen a massive jump in the android numbers, Samsung leading those numbers with their public bout with apple, so it doesn't surprise me that he would say such things as MS is the cause.
the end all beat all is our economy in north america. when the prices go up, people buy less, or smart, i for one only buy parts when they are needed or on an unbelievable sale. since i, like many builders, build a system with long lasting reliable parts, then my trips to the comp store or website are few and far between.
these are my opinions though, and i'm just responding to a video where you seem quite agitated over something that shouldn't warrant this much anger. to each their own though, and you are entitled to your opinions. a little explanation into your experiences though would of been helpful.
AMD FX-6100 6core @ 3.3, AsRock 970 extreme4 MB, dual geforce 450 in sli mode, 8 gigs HyperX ram, NZXT Phantom full tower case, 850 watt carsair PSU, Corsair H80i AIO watercooler, OCZ vertex 60gb SSD, 1.5tb and 500gb WD HDD(backup and software drives), Logitech k800 keyboard, razer naga epic mouse, 42-inch insignia led tv in HDMI mode, Windows 8 pro.
I dunno, M$ is always to blame but W8 won't kill PC there is W7 and Linux. Just like RetroGamerr1991 on youtube said that's what happen.
I thought that Windows 8 was shit before I used it. Once I bought my laptop (Toshiba C855-S530B love it) that had Windows 8 64-bit I got used to it and you know what I think it's faster than seven is my proof is my parents laptop with 6GB ram (same cpu) is a tad bit slower (negligible)you don't have to use metro and everything is the same other than not having a start button. Really if you don't like Windows 8 go back to seven.
Rodney, Windows 8 is perfectly fine on a PC. Its quicker than 7 and except for the start screen, is almost exactly the same. It even has some improvements.
You can ignore the start screen most of the time anyway. Just pin your programs to the task bar.
Have you actually genuinely tried to use it for a while? (at least a few days). It seems like you have only looked at it for a few minutes, but gave up straight away because its a bit different.
So Rodney, you arent even going to respond to your viewers now?
We have graphics cards with so much teraflops but 99% of the games still looks crap, and now the next generation consoles are on the doorstep i wonder if pc gaming is gonna improve. And since Microsoft isn't really helping developers i wonder if its gonna change anytime soon.
The PC market here in North America has declined considerably over the past few years. Many of these companies are sponsors of mine and I hear it first hand. PC companies are downsizing and restructuring which means closing down plants, offices, layoffs, etc... Many are moving to cheaper PC products, for example affordable cases and also getting into the mobile market. The PC won;t die entirely, but the glory days are over.
I think the lazy nature of the human race is too not want to learn, and want everything layed out for them,and unfortunately companies like Microsoft are also choosing these bad paths...
Android is a lazy mans operating system...you don't have to think...you just follow the flock and your tablet or phone eventually slows down to the point where you do a factory reset and start again....no big deal...a 7 yr old can handle that....but to implement this into the PC world is dumbing everything down...hence the reason we see so many defending it, and so many quick to defend the console world.
Don't get me wrong consoles are great at the start of their own cycle, the programmers get the games going better and better and make it look like the systems are going better than at release...but for gaming purposes , a console can not compete with a pc system that constantly is upgradable, so some of the blame has to lay with consoles... most of these people that are defending 8 are the same people that always ask you for help to fix their "real" operating system and game on consoles, as they dont have to think about tweaking and performance boosting the console, cause you GET WHAT YOU GET>>>SIMPLE FOR SIMPLETONS.... everything has been heading to the dumbed down world that people secretly want...
People want EASY...and that sucks to anyone that has an ounce of intelligence... easy is boring ...BORING BORING BORING .... and Microsoft are cashing in on the fact that the average wants dumb... unfortunately if this keeps up , it will be to the detriment of invention of new tech in Pc's, AND, get this--> eventually will filter down to less new tech heading to consoles... as everything console comes from tech that was developed in PC world, So wanting dumb will eventually kill the pc market as we know it.. AND in turn slow down all tech as we know it TODAY
Yep, in this modern age, most people want easy in everything they do.
Why? Here in North America we're working our asses off to try and afford everything and most hardly have time to spend with their kids, let alone build computers. Most couldn't be bothered, so they buy netbooks, notebooks and/or tablets.
Within the last few years these mobile devices have gotten very affordable so it's a no brainer. For example, I built PCs for my parents ever since day one, but recently they upgraded to a laptop because everything is in one device, it was cheap and did everything they wanted. Now if you're into hardcore applications that require powerful computing power, you'll need a PC, but your average Joe doesn't fall into this category.
Personally, I prefer a PC for work since I find to more productive, but I've grown up using PCs. Although, I also love my mobile devices, especially my smartphone since I can get work done when out of the office.
Windows 8 is not fully developed.
I agree, but why was it released for the PC now. For the tablet, it works rather well, but that's not the case for the PC. For the PC Windows 8 is most unproductive & infuriating OS to date. Let's hope they tweak it and the upcoming SP is more like Windows 7.
Maybe if they force people to have windows 8 to play the most recent games... That thing is horrible.
Windows 8 is not helping no. But i don't think PC is in decline at all. Over here at least the PC as a gaming platform is becoming more popular every day. Maybe when the new consoles hit the market that will all change again. But i am not worried...people been saying PC is death for decades now.
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